Who Runs The World? The Global Scheme Of Things

Hi Everyone

I have read through a number of threads and the responses. I notice that there is one specific line of thought (systematic theology) which I cannot agree. It relates to those who apply Judaism as the whore and Jerusalem as the Great City.

I could say much on this to disprove that theory. However, as it would involve a massive debate requiring me to spend all my time responding to the replies. That would be time I simply do not have (I need to spend time looking for a job and accommodation) so I hope you don't mind if I limit my the extent of my replies.

However, I DID write a long article on the subject of this thread, which will show you the position I take. I will say just one thing here. We cannot build an interpretation based on one or two isolated verses that are actually a bit vague and could be misinterpreted, such as Jerusalem being linked to the verse that says "Sodom and Egypt where our Lord died". The verse does not specifically state that it is Jerusalem.

The early church died en masse in Rome. Paul stated in Phil 3 that he completed what was lacking in Christ's death and that he united in the fellowship of suffering for Christ. It is a mystery but indicates that the "spirit" behind the crucifixion of Jesus continued in Rome by the death of HIS BODY (which is what the church is called). In a real sense Jesus was dying in Rome, because the church was dying. However, it is just my interpretation but it does fit with other scriptures. Your interpretation of Jerusalem being the Great City is WELL out of context with the rest of the Book of Revelation.

Since when did Jerusalem have seven heads and 10 horns. The colours of red/purple do not match the colours mentioned in Leviticus which ALSO include blue. Blue is not mentioned in Revelation. But there is no blue in the Vatican, so it DOES match the Vatican. Anyway, as I said, I do not have time to go into all this.

May I leave this article entitled "Explaining The Beast With Seven Heads and Ten Horns and The Woman Riding The Beast" found on this link following link watchmanforjesus.blogspot.com/2011/07/beast-with-seven-heads-ten-horns-and.html
which (I believe) proves who the whore is and who the 7 heads are.

However, please read my report below FIRST before you look at the above link. The link above will make more sense in the light of the report below.

Anyway, what has been said above leads nicely into the purpose of this thread, my report.


I have been inspired to write this article. Basically, someone was concerned about the activities of a group called Common Purpose which are growing very rapidly and seem to be behind the scenes pushing for the EU takeover of Britain. I guess I was intrigued because of the name. Another one with "purpose" in the title. Also because I wondered if they were another Vatican (or should we say Illuminati) puppet. All part of the scheme of things?

This report has taken a long time to put together. It comes through much research of all inter-relating information and evidence and the concern to present the facts, with the strong desire for truth. I have also compared these findings with prophecies in the Word Of God and the Bible’s general teaching, so that I know what things should or should not be said.

As this is such a serious post I HAVE to be thorough. I also want to write things which Christians can use in their witness and be encouraged, so I have to be careful to edify, ie not just give information (which could be detrimental for believers) but also accompanied by encouraging words.
So who is running the World? My full report.

I will start this report by getting everything into the right perspective from God’s standpoint of the events. We learn about God’s “bird’s eye” view (for want of better expression) of global events from the Bible and from sanctified logic/discernment. Therefore, let us look at the scriptures first. The first one says it all!

Psalms 2:1-3
Why do the nations conspire and the peoples plot in vain? The kings of the earth take their stand and the rulers gather together against the LORD and against his Anointed One. "Let us break their chains," they say, "and throw off their fetters."

What we see here is that the hidden (behind the scenes) conspiracies ARE IN VAIN!

They may plot etc, but if the Lord intervenes their plans become in vain. God can at a moment destroy the plans of those who are trying to manipulate everything. So, although much of my blogsite (and this post) tries to make sense of the terrible things going on behind the scenes and exposing the GIANT scheme of things, we should not be worried because everything could fall apart in an instance and if it doesn't .... well Jesus is returning, Hallelujah!

Consider the great empires of the past: The Egyptian, Assyrian, Babylonian, Persian, Greek, Roman. British. Do any of these still exist? Kingdoms come and Kingdoms go. Then there are religious dominations like the Catholic church during the dark ages. Were the Catholic church in control when the reformation was born? The fact is that (as Jesus said to Pontius Pilate) they are only in authority or have controlling capacities because the Lord has given them it. It could be taken away in an instance. The fact is that the Lord and His true church reign forever! God is in ultimate control, even though He may allow satan to control the Earth (relatively speaking) for a period of time.

The fact is we should not be afraid. Jesus already told us too look up because our redemption is drawing near and that we will suffer tribulation in this world. So, whatever organisation is controlling things behind the scenes, it is the same result = persecution and tribulation for a short while and then the Glory. Throughout church history the saints have suffered much for their faith and Jesus said this would be so. Why should we be any different? So do not focus so much time on these hidden but emerging things, that you become fearful, but focus on Jesus!

I will now briefly summarise what the apostle John wrote in one of his letters 1 John 2:15-16: Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

Being no Greek student, I am informed that the word for "world" is "the cosmos”, ie world system that is anti Jesus. The lust of the flesh (as Paul wrote in his letters) are to do with the ungodly desires,cravings of the sinful nature. Paul lists these in Galatians 5. The lust of the eyes is to do with coveting things: power and wealth. Lust of the flesh is what is going on inside us, the other is how we are influenced externally. The external pressures we face creates a desire to become one with the world system so that we can succeed in the eyes of a godless world and it’s ungodly world system. This worldly system is governed and controlled (through a godless system) by satan and his invisible army and government (principalities in the heavenlies).

We are told that Christians should not love these things. We are told that our citizenship is in heaven not on the Earth. Jesus said I am not of the world, even as you are not of the world. Jesus said to seek those things which are above, not on the Earth.
John 15:18-20 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.

As Christians we are told to “walk in the spirit and not gratify the desires of the flesh”
The world system (in the hands of the evil one) will always feed the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes and the pride of life, so that all the people are caught up in the system. As Christians we must be aware of what the world is about so that we too are not ensnared in it.

Okay, that was my brief exegesis and understanding of that text.

I will now go on elaborate on some of these points by using the revelations of the scriptures, how current events are not unusual and always been that way throughout human history and why this is so.

Before God created humans, He created angels. They are described as “ministering spirits”. God created multitudes of angels. They are made most beautiful and glorious. One of the archangels (maybe the most glorious) was named Lucifer which means “light bearer”. God called him “son of the morning” Isaiah 14:12.

Ezekiel 28 and Isaiah 14 tell us about the fall of Lucifer and his change of name to satan “adversary”

Isaiah 14:12-16
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms

Ezekiel 28:14-15
Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

Book of Revelation says that satan took a third of the angels with him in his rebellion against God.

So we come to the garden of Eden! God created Adam and Eve perfect. Everything God creates IS perfect (at the beginning).

Satan believed in the lie that he was god and equal with God and in fact it seems that he thought himself to be greater than God. If we look at Book of Revelation it is clear that satan still believes he can ultimately overthrow God, so he is very self absorbed and delusionable.

Jesus said that satan is a thief who comes to kill, steal and destroy. Satan wants to be worshipped and to rule. Notice (in one of the 3 temptations Jesus faced) he tempts Jesus to worship him. In fact satan uses “the lust of the flesh, lust of the eyes and the pride of life” in the 3 temptations. If satan can get Jesus to sin he wins as it would have meant that (because now no human could ever be saved) he would ultimately have destroyed all human souls.

So it is not surprising (knowing the character of satan) that he wants to destroy what God makes beautiful. He wants to destroy the highest of God’s creation: humans. So he tempts them to become like God. Satan since then has been seeking a people who believe in the lie that they can become like God. He also empowers them to achieve great things. By creating this delusion in the minds of mankind (that they can become god) he has been able to set up ungodly world systems (through them) in opposition to God’s rule. So you get the “sons of God” those who live their lives in submission to God’s way and those who are not “sons of God” Those who follow the lie that they don’t need God and work towards a godless society who govern the world through an evil power coming from the evil one.

We see the evidence of this through historical information on Nimrod, “a mighty man” (as the bible puts it), built a city and a tower designed to oppose God. The purpose was to create a powerful organisation and control the people from the headquarters. It would receive supernatural powers from satan to conquer the world. It was a high tower for astrological, magical practices. Nimrod became a god to the people and was worshipped as god by the people. He was probably a forerunner or type of the antichrist as he was clearly possessed by satan himself with great powers. As satan has always wanted to be worshipped he received worship through Nimrod and the Babylonic religion which was set up. Please see biblebelievers.com/babylon/00index.htm for a historical record showing the full outworking of the Babylonic religion and its global world system and its subsequent outworkings today with the New World Order.

Notice, God INTERVENED at the tower of Babel and interfered with this original globalisation intention. The people were scattered and they were unable to communicate with each other any more because of the confusion of tongues. So satan’s second attempt to totally rule mankind failed again because God intervened.

However, the evil Babylonic religion ideas were already placed into the minds of the people and the latter Babylonic empire would spread these ideas throughout the empire. So (although satan does not have dominion over every human being, he is gradually building up an increasingly evil world system which God has allowed him to be in charge of until God says enough is enough and then “The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever”.

When satan said to Jesus “if you bow down and worship me I will give you the kingdoms for they were handed to me” was he lying? Probably not, because Jesus did not say it was a lie but simply stated that only the true God should be worshipped and Him alone.

The Apostle John said “We know that we are of God, and that the whole world lies in the power of the evil one” The word “world” here is “cosmos” which again is the world (global) scheme of things which is governed by those influenced by satan. It has its authority over the peoples of the Earth, so indirectly satan is ruling the people too. So there are two groups of people. The people of God (who have been rescued from that kingdom of darkness into God’s glorious light) and those who are unsaved who are still in darkness influenced by the prince of darkness.

So John is clearly stating that satan is in control over much of the world. But he cannot reign completely (although God has given him a long lead, example seen in book of Job) because God has the ultimate say on what happens on the Earth and God’s people bring light and salt upon the Earth. They can be persecuted but they cannot be soulfully destroyed.

So what I am saying is that satan’s methods of rule have always been the same. Get people to rebel against God, promise them and give them great supernatural powers to rule on Earth, get them to worship him (which are often accompanied with supernatural manifestations), set up governing authorities, strategies etc to globalise and pull everything together. The strategies would use a multitude of secretive groups networked together. These have to be secretive until the purposes are fulfilled so that they are not exposed too soon. These groups are deliberately seen to be unlinked or even opposed, so as to smoke screen society about what is actually going on.

Ephesians 6:12 says it all: For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, butagainst the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places

We are not fighting against human beings when we try to change things in this world. We must understand that human beings are not the source of what is happening. So if we vote one man out of power satan simply replaces with someone else he can control. I know God DOES intervene in seasons by raising “such a man at a time like this” but these times are restricted and usually coincide with a time when a nation (not just a few people) repented and called out to God (Israel, Ninevah).

Realise that although very interesting to figure everything out, we should be focussing on God’s kingdom not on satan’s. We are not in the darkness but in the light. We are to seek those things which are above and not those things on Earth. We should only concentrate on those things we are able to change. We are to seek first God’s kingdom. If we concern ourselves too much with the global scheme of things we may get entangled up within it and the seed becomes unfruitful.

Our focus then becomes worldly (meaning we are no longer any different from everybody else) as if living on this Earth is important when it is NOT. Jesus said my kingdom is not of this world. His kingdom is entirely different and is ruled with absolute truth in holiness, purity, loveliness, excellence, praiseworthiness and is full of true peace, joy and love. The full culmination of this will be when Jesus reigns on Earth during the one thousand years, but for now His kingdom is in our hearts. We cannot produce that Earthly kingdom by our own means and it cannot happen until Jesus reigns physically here after He removes the kingdom of darkness.

Having said that, we are called to be watchman. To watch what is going on and pray. So it is useful to understand what is going on so that we can intercede and comfort one another, using these events as a witnessing tool to save as many as possible. It is also good so that we can alert and warn fellow believers to “come out of Babylon” in these last days. So that we are all prepared for the return of Jesus.

So now to reveal my findings:

What I have noticed is how many organisations (not just Common Purpose) seem to fit together into one GIANT conspiracy.

For example where do you think Rick Warren got his ideas from of the PEACE agenda? Also note he seems to have borrowed the term Common Purpose (founded in 1989) in his movement Purpose Driven in the 1990's. Did you know that Common Purpose founder Julia Middleton collaborated with New Age queen Anita Roddick in 1988 to work together on creating Common Purpose? Where did New Age originate? How did Emerging Church start? Who are the Bilderbergers? How do they fit in? What about the Illuminati?

I will introduce this section by first quoting from the aforenamed “Somebody” as it illustrates something. And then replying
:
“Hi
I had just spent a night looking at Brian Gerrish's videos about Common Purpose.Also I had looked at what other people had to say as well as CP's own website. As a bible believing Christian I have really had my eyes opened over the last few years.

I feel totally let down with the realisation that we have been sold out as a nation to the EU and that really our politicians are just puppets that do the bidding of their masters. I would truly love to find out what motivates these masters. Are they really involved in secret societies and occult practices - it would appear so.

I think that they are engineering this financial crisis, we are seeing, problems with Greece and other EU states, but the UK cant be far behind with more problems coming our way.I feel we are on a countdown to the final events of history. We don’t know the exact sequence but I think we all have that feeling that things are 'hotting up'.

Getting back to Common Purpose, I just feel when you look at the people who have done the courses and the cost to the public purse, the fact that graduates supposedly meet together and operate under Chatham House rules, all this bothers me. I am sick to my stomach of all the political correctness”

I believe this person maybe giving too much attention to the World System, as if things could be better than they are. Like many people maybe they are still hoping for a utopia on Earth right now and that this life is something to desire and be enjoyed now. We must remember that this “world” is passing away. The life we experience now is just transient. When Jesus said that we would have life and have it more abundantly He is not referring to enjoying the things of the world or life in THIS realm. He is talking about a transformed life by the power of the Holy Spirit to live a victorious Christian life over sin and condemnation. We enjoy peace, love and joy in our hearts despite the circumstances of living in this decaying world. We must remind ourselves that things will get worse – not better and so gear ourselves to be ready for it. We are told to rejoice and not complain when things get worse.

However, this person makes some valid points, which we will now examine:

I started the investigation by researching Common Purpose. I ended up by researching many different organisations which all seemed to be connected in one way or another. I felt I needed to look at the histories behind these organisations and how/why they were founded. I couldn’t help but notice many common traits/ideas.

Basically they all came from 2 camps of history and both of these from Babylon. What we now call “new Age” and through Babylonic Mysteries religion. Both these can be traced way back into the time (and before) of the Babylonic Empire. As already discussed earlier, Babylon was a religious and political empire which influenced the whole world. Although empires and kingdoms have come and gone, the anti god philosophies and religious mysteries have been handed down and followed by subsequent empires.

New Age
The New Age movement is a re-re-re invention of Babylonic philosophies and religion which has been followed throughout the centuries under one name or another. It shapes the thought processes of all areas of life. You find it in Education establishments, the work place, governments, religions, social practices etc.

This old religious system is now called New Age. It was taken from the astrological ideas that the world goes through various ages. They say that the age of pisces (the Christian era) is now over and we are in the “new age” of aquarius. The Emerging church (a new age Christianity) call it a paradigm shift. The age of Aquarius is an age of spiritual enlightenment or illumination. It is the "Dawning of the Age of Aquarius". This is to be an Era of Unity, Love and Religious Brotherhood among Humanity. The underlying idea of the New Age is one of ecumenism, a One World Global Society.

From infancy to old age a generation has arisen brainwashed into new age ideas and goals of “self actualisation”. We cannot escape it. It is in our face, everywhere through the media. We are told that we can be whatever we want to be. It aims to move you from a place of uselessness to becoming a god (they call it self-actualisation) moving step by step from the point of the realisation of your inner divinity and therefore understanding/knowing the potential of your life to making the potential an actuality. The whole philosophy focuses on self self self. It is recycled garden of Eden and Tower of Babel stuff. It is popular because self loves to be tickled. It attracts those who have “itching ears” who want to become powerful.

New Age is very intertwined with many aspects of life. So much so that new age thinking is networked within vast numbers of organisations. Many of these are secret organisations.

There is a link between New Age and Common Purpose. Julia Middleton called upon New Age Entrepeneur Anita Roddick to help her found Common Purpose. Many of her ideas for Common Purpose came from New Age ideas of networking. Her book about Managing beyond your authority is about managing your network of contacts whom are currently outside your immediate area of authority, for the common good of your goals. Ie find people and organisations with the same common purpose who you can influence to achieve the Common Purpose goals. The realisation that you need the co-operation of those externally to get them to work with you to achieve the results.

Common Purpose follow New Age values and therefore support the idea of “oneness” (being one with the universe. Therefore they support the Common Purpose of globalisation and the New World Order. In fact this is the case with all new age groups who are working together to globalise and save the world from say climate change. Therefore they support a one world governance.

I don’t know for sure if Rick Warren was ever trained by Common Purpose. It is clear however that he must have read her book or at least been trained by someone who had, because the way he is operating is using Common Purpose ideas. Did you know that he consulted a new-age guru for ideas on church growth. Maybe this new age guru had been trained in Common Purpose. Certainly Rick is using the networking idea and gathering influential people together under a “common purpose” for world peace.

As Common Purpose is building up an “army” of tomorrow’s leaders who can all manage beyond their authority, many organisations (including the EU) seem to be hiring graduates from Common Purpose to aid them in the globalisation process.

Babylonic Mysteries Religion and The Catholic Church
Please also read "Why The Catholic Church Is Not A Christian Organisation" found on my blog page: watchmanforjesus.blogspot.com/2010/03/why-catholic-church-is-not-christian.html


Babylonic Mysteries religion was taken over by the Vatican system. Ever since the Roman Empire hijacked the Babylonic religion it has tried to maintain its stranglehold over the whole world through the religious system (once the political system fell apart). Although Rome ceased to rule politically it ruled most of the world by a reign of terror by the Catholic Church until the reformation in the 16th Century. Ever since the Reformation the Vatican has sought ways to regain its power and even extend it to total global control.

Ignatius of Loyola is a key player in this aspect. He and his six friends founded the Jesuit Order in 1534, and it received official Papal sanction in the year 1540. Ignatius became the Jesuit Order's first General. The Illuminati secret society then emerged.Ignatius Loyola was the Founder of the Jesuit Order, the "Spiritual Army" of the Roman Catholic Church, and he was also the Founder of the Witchcraft group, The Illuminati!

It is very clear that the Jesuit Army was merely a Witchcraft group that was used to spread Roman Catholic doctrine throughout the whole world! That is what the Jesuits are for... they are used to undo all that Protestantism has done, and to gain back lands and people that the Church has lost to Protestantism. One of the ways that they do this in todays world is by ecumenism.

Now here is how The Babylonic religion (as “Christianised” and continued by the Roman Catholic church) is linked to the New Age of today and shows how the Vatican is using new age in its globalisation agenda.

The ancient name for Babylonian Mysticism (or finding ways to get in touch with "The One", "The All", or Satan) was called "Illuminism". The Babylonians who were initiated into the Mystery Religion were said to be in possession of Illumination or THE INNER LIGHT. Supposedly, this meant they had been ENLIGHTENED or aware of the fact that they were gods. (See Encyclopedia Brittanica, Vol. 14, 1910, pg. 320)

The Western equivalent to this Eastern Mysticism is the Hermeticism or Gnosticism. The Gnostics were said to possess the secret knowledge that they were in reality, "Little gods", and that Lucifer was the rightful Ruler of this World! The name Lucifer actually means Morning Star or The Illuminated One (light bearer). Thus, the various Mystery Religions taught that it is Lucifer (or Satan) who gives us light and shows us that we are God and have no need of repentance, but that we need only realize the "God within" and bring it to it's full potential.

Various Secret Societies throughout the Ages have taught this Babylonian Mysticism, because they knew that these Mysteries were based upon the doctrine of Luciferianism. They were known for centuries as "The Illuminati". Their name was derived from Lucifer's name: "The Illuminated One”.

The illuminati has spread its tentacles throughout the world through infiltrating organisations and founding secret societies to work together for globalisation. The most powerful bankers, the Rothchild’s and the Bilderberger organisation have such Vatican links.

In summary of the question “who runs the world and the global scheme of things? “

The answer is as follows:
God is the overseer who will intervene when necessary but because of man’s rebellion toward God He allows satan to control them through political and religious powers. These powers are networked together to form a united purpose to unite and rule the world by satan using his representative the “ac” as the world leader. God will allow this for a short time but will then bring satan’s empire crashing down. Then the church will reign with Christ for all eternity.

For a more recent example of how the political, economic and religious conspiracies are fitting together. Please read these reports:
The Manhattan Declaration and Westminster 2010 Declaration. A New Globalised Ecumenical Movement Emerging on
watchmanforjesus.blogspot.com/2010/05/manhattan-declaration-and-westminster.html
and the comments written on those reports.

So the cry goes up now, “come out of Babylon” and “do not participate in her sins”.

That is a very good piece of literature John I have just skimmed over it and find it fascinating on many levels!

I have to go to work but when I get back I will check into your blogspots etc. and do a little more carousing of literature you have linked to.

Peace and Love

hi john.

thank you for all the work!

i know all that though.

rome isnt christian because its Babylonian Talmudism.

she got judaized and struggles with it (losing) i dont doubt many RCs are saved though.

Christ was crucifed just outside the gate of Jerusalm, not in Rome and spiritualizing to make Rome the MOTHER of harlots doesn't work.

thanks, but i've already done all the work on JERSUALEM AS THE WHORE. SHE JUST IS. but she has daughters. i can give you all the greek on it, and 12 pages of exegesis, but you've made up your mind. doesnt really matter in the end.

thank you zone

ps: i dont live in fear, nor care about this world outside truth and the gospel. you're as much knowledgable of hidden events as the rest of us, so we're prolly about equal in that regard.

common purpose/communism etc are all the things you described, right back to Nimrod. you discuss Babylon, but leave out The leaven of the Pharisees and the Talmud, which is the driver.



JESUS CHRIST DID NOT DIE IN ROME HE DIED IN JERUSALEM. end of story.

(that's a horrible thing to do)

the hersies the church deals with are the same:

GNOSTICISM AND JUDAIZING. both come together in the Mother and all her daughters.

Ok I answered you concerning the whore in this thread:

LINK :::MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS

zone wrote:
JESUS CHRIST DID NOT DIE IN ROME HE DIED IN JERUSALEM. end of story.

Hi Zone

Why does John mention Egypt and Sodom as where Jesus died? Is that not spiritualising something? Why mention Egypt and Sodom if it relates to Jerusalem? Why not just say "Jerusalem"?

I have to admit I do not have an answer to that question. Surely we cannot build up a complete systematic theology on one verse of Revelation and state that Jerusalem and the Jews are the whore. What about Semiramis as the whore? Ever since Babylon took centre stage with Nimrod and Semiramis, Babylonic MYSTERY RELIGION has spread ALWAYS with the woman and child religion and always has the goddess (whore) as central.

I cannot accept that the Book of Revelation is talking about Israel. I will give my reasons on a new thread entitled "Has God Finished With The Jews And The Nation Of Israel?" which I have also just posted onto my blog.

watchmanforjesus.blogspot.com/2011/10/has-god-finished-with-jews-and-nation.html

John Chingford wrote:

Hi Zone

Why does John mention Egypt and Sodom as where Jesus died? Is that not spiritualising something? Why mention Egypt and Sodom if it relates to Jerusalem? Why not just say "Jerusalem"?

I have to admit I do not have an answer to that question. Surely we cannot build up a complete systematic theology on one verse of Revelation and state that Jerusalem and the Jews are the whore. What about Semiramis as the whore? Ever since Babylon took centre stage with Nimrod and Semiramis, Babylonic MYSTERY RELIGION has spread ALWAYS with the woman and child religion and always has the goddess (whore) as central.

http://shalach.org/Angels/BabylonTheGreat.htm

find out what BAYLONIAN TALMUDISM TEACHES.

John Chingford wrote:

Hi Zone

Why does John mention Egypt and Sodom as where Jesus died? Is that not spiritualising something? Why mention Egypt and Sodom if it relates to Jerusalem? Why not just say "Jerusalem"?

I have to admit I do not have an answer to that question. Surely we cannot build up a complete systematic theology on one verse of Revelation and state that Jerusalem and the Jews are the whore. What about Semiramis as the whore? Ever since Babylon took centre stage with Nimrod and Semiramis, Babylonic MYSTERY RELIGION has spread ALWAYS with the woman and child religion and always has the goddess (whore) as central.

Maybe because it says "spiritual" Egypt and Sodom. And doesnt say Jerusalem. But where the Lord was
crucified...so noone could say it was spiritualized. As it certainly is stated with Egypt and Sodom.

In other words its not possible to spiritualize "where also our Lord was crucified" Like it would be if
it said Jerualsem.

And its not possible to not spiritualize Egypt and Sodom since it says "spiritual". Seems like a careful
anticipation went into how this was written.

It's a darn good question why would you say Sodom and Egypt unless you are speaking either analagously or metaphorically?

Analagously ; Sodom >refers to the sexually immoral the whore

................Egypt >refers to the Idolatry of Godkings

Metaphorically; Sodom > perverse or wicked

Egypt >Bondage suffered for Idolatry

Could it be that scripture is referring to the sins comitted in these places and the atonement Jesus paid for them?

John Chingford wrote:

zone wrote:
JESUS CHRIST DID NOT DIE IN ROME HE DIED IN JERUSALEM. end of story.

Hi Zone

Why does John mention Egypt and Sodom as where Jesus died? Is that not spiritualising something? Why mention Egypt and Sodom if it relates to Jerusalem? Why not just say "Jerusalem"?

I have to admit I do not have an answer to that question. Surely we cannot build up a complete systematic theology on one verse of Revelation and state that Jerusalem and the Jews are the whore. What about Semiramis as the whore? Ever since Babylon took centre stage with Nimrod and Semiramis, Babylonic MYSTERY RELIGION has spread ALWAYS with the woman and child religion and always has the goddess (whore) as central.

Paganism as the whore yeah?

Nope that doesnt work. Paganism was never BETROTHED TO GOD, so how can it cheat on Him? Paganism is the LOVER that Jerusalem went a-whoring with as testified by Gods Word many times.

John Chingford wrote:I cannot accept that the Book of Revelation is talking about Israel. I will give my reasons on a new thread entitled "Has God Finished With The Jews And The Nation Of Israel?" which I have also just posted onto my blog.

watchmanforjesus.blogspot.com/2011/10/has-god-finished-with-jews-and-nation.html

.....

I say this in the nicest possible way Chingy....\\

I reject ALL forms of DISPENSATIONALISM.....totally and emphatically.

There is NO race/religion/nation/country that is in any way special in Gods eye. Everyone gets the same deal..its either JESUS or the FIRES of hell.

The only 'nation' that is special is the elect priesthood nation of true Christians.

MUSKOKAMAN wrote:It's a darn good question why would you say Sodom and Egypt unless you are speaking either analagously or metaphorically?

Analagously ; Sodom >refers to the sexually immoral the whore

................Egypt >refers to the Idolatry of Godkings

Metaphorically; Sodom > perverse or wicked

Egypt >Bondage suffered for Idolatry

Could it be that scripture is referring to the sins comitted in these places and the atonement Jesus paid for them?

That is rather insightful Musk. Could be.

Doc when we discussed the Earth is stationary you kept on insisting that the Bible never states the Earth moves. as far as I can see (from the scriptures) you are correct. But when you rejected our suggestion that the statement that the sun moves was poetry or allegory, you would not accept it. You asked us to categorically quote scriptures to say the Earth moves.

However, now that I (using your same method of argument) state that the word Jerusalem is not used but the passage CLEARLY states "figuratively" or "spiritualised" where our Lord died, you insert a word that does not appear "Jerusalem". We need to interpret the Bible using the same methods throughout the Bible consistently. You have not used your same method here that you used for a stationary Earth.

Anyway, I have investigated further and are ready to accept that John was referring to Jerusalem. However, just because the words "Great City" is used to describe Jerusalem, does not mean that the great City "Babylon the Great" is the same city. Check out Jonah 1:2. It says "go to that GREAT CITY Ninevah". Are you saying that Jonah was asked to go to Jerusalem?

Clearly God asked him to go to Ninevah (also a Great City). Therefore, just because Jerusalem is called a Great City does not mean that Babylon the Great is the same City.

We do know that the two witnesses will preach in Jerusalem as per Revelation 11. The passage that mentions them is not talking about the whore City. The whore City begins in chapter 13. Chapters 11-12 talks about God's people and them being persecuted and discusses their victory, but thereafter (from Chapter 13) it focuses on the whore and the beast, ie "a tale of two cities".

ps, I do accept that Revelation is talking about physical Jerusalem. However,it is figuratively likened to Sodom and Egypt. If it was called Sodom and Gomorra it would make sense (because they are always linked), but this time Gomorra is not mentioned. Why has Egypt been included? I guess time will tell. Maybe we will not understand that until the two witnesses start preaching there. Whatever we come up with will be wild speculation because it says it is "figurative" ie an allegory, parable.

John, the book of revelation is a talking about the great city Jerusalem.

The whore of babylon.

The two witnesses, what does that mean? Is this a metaphor?

Or are you actually expecting a coupla peole to stand up in Jerusalem and preach some stuff?

John, dont fal into the trap of reading revealtion like a hollywood script.

You ever notice the number 7 is an obvious holy number?

7 continents 7 seas 7 days in a week

What if the 7 hills was representitive of the 7 continents suggesting world domination or that these prophecies wouldn't happen until all 7 continents were dominated over by the Whore.

Elizabeth the 1 and the following English empire would fit this description well as she was never married and had no children. Therefore she was never a widow. To boot it was her father who by his own desire to be sole regent under no authority other than his own who helped bring about the reformation in order to divorce his many wives legally so as not to be contrary to doctrine even though the pope refused to grant such dispensation based soley on the bible and it's teachings.

This period in history the 16th century is the birthplace of the following;

The reformation

The Jesuit order

The age of enlightenment as lucifer is the light bearer so is enlightenment

The rise of the west

The first circumnavigation of the Globe

The first recorded epidemic of small pox

The sack of Rome

The Muscovy company becomes the first joint stock holding company laying the groundwork for what we now call the Stock exchanges

Centralized Banking is first introduced in Europe

Just to mention a few I could go on for pages but this should suffice.

What is the greatest city in the world in the last 400 years?

Who has controlled the world in the last 400 years? (it ain't Jerusalem)

What is the most common language spoken today in the world?

what empire in all history is the ONLY one to claim the sun never sets on her?

7 hills = 7 continents

The two witnesses Who are they?

Man you switch your mind like the wind Musky.

So now the british empire is the whore?

I thought we established Jerusalem is the whore?

Doc, I assume that you are of the Post Millennial, partial preterist camp?
Do you know the origins behind the preterist views?

They were spread by Jesuit priests as a counter reformation tactic seeking to disprove the widely held view by Protestants that the RC was the whore of Babylon. It is they who instigated Jerusalem as the whore (to save their backs) and the preterist view that the Book of Revelation had already been fulfilled in 70AD.

John Chingford wrote:Doc, I assume that you are of the Post Millennial, partial preterist camp?
Do you know the origins behind the preterist views?

They were spread by Jesuit priests as a counter reformation tactic seeking to disprove the widely held view by Protestants that the RC was the whore of Babylon. It is they who instigated Jerusalem as the whore (to save their backs) and the preterist view that the Book of Revelation had already been fulfilled in 70AD.

No John I'm Amillenial, I.E. we are living in the millenium right now.

I wasnt aware that the widely held view by protestants was that the RCC was the whore. Only that it was antichrist.

If you have documentation that shows Jesuits instigated Jerusalem as the whore I'd be happy to look it over. As I see it there is no need as the concept is absolutely scriptural and logical as I've shown in this thread:

MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS

By the way, the man who founded the Jesuit order was a crypto marrano jew named ignatious loyola.

The jesuits are the talmudic secret police that control the vatican and the RCC.

The Jesuits and the Jews

Strangelove wrote:I wasnt aware that the widely held view by protestants was that the RCC was the whore. Only that it was antichrist.

If you have documentation that shows Jesuits instigated Jerusalem as the whore I'd be happy to look it over.

There is a lot of material on the internet which discusses these things. I will give you a sample (please add the www at the front.

This is the best one I found (so far). It is a bit wordy, but contains a lot of useful information:
gospel-herald.com/futurism_history.htm

lavistachurchofchrist.org/LVanswers/2008/05-15.html

biblicaluniversalism.org/articles_preterist.html

amazingdiscoveries.org/RT_encyclopedia_Futurism_Preterism_Catholic.html

John Chingford wrote:

Strangelove wrote:I wasnt aware that the widely held view by protestants was that the RCC was the whore. Only that it was antichrist.

If you have documentation that shows Jesuits instigated Jerusalem as the whore I'd be happy to look it over.

There is a lot of material on the internet which discusses these things. I will give you a sample (please add the www at the front.

This is the best one I found (so far). It is a bit wordy, but contains a lot of useful information:
gospel-herald.com/futurism_history.htm

lavistachurchofchrist.org/LVanswers/2008/05-15.html

biblicaluniversalism.org/articles_preterist.html

amazingdiscoveries.org/RT_encyclopedia_Futurism_Preterism_Catholic.html

....

I see no mention at all of Jerusalem as the whore of babylon. Maybe you can quote specific sentences which support your assertion?

Strangelove wrote:Man you switch your mind like the wind Musky.

So now the british empire is the whore?

I thought we established Jerusalem is the whore?

British Israelism? Just a thought Doc.

Jerusalem may become the whore but she doesn't run the world yet.

If she does then where is the evidence to back up the claim.

They weren't even a country until 1948 and yes that is an obvious evidential piece of info but where is the evidence for who is pulling the strings from Jerusalem today.

I haven't left the Game Doc. just lining up my ducks!

Jerusalem is the whore. She was the Lords chosen. And yet she killed the Lords Prophets. She killed Jesus the son of God.

Jesus said how he wanted to gather her together like a hen gathers its chics, but they would not.

Jerusalem is the whore but she does not run the world. There is a god of this world and that system is what runs this world. It permeates everything. News, Politics, Television (hellevision), governments, people.

A whore doesn't run the world. A whore causes destruction. A whore makes her husband sad.

Where was Jesus crucified? Do you think that was just coincidence? Jerusalem is redeemed, and yet she still will not...

MUSKOKAMAN wrote:

Strangelove wrote:Man you switch your mind like the wind Musky.

So now the british empire is the whore?

I thought we established Jerusalem is the whore?

British Israelism? Just a thought Doc.

Jerusalem may become the whore but she doesn't run the world yet.

If she does then where is the evidence to back up the claim.

They weren't even a country until 1948 and yes that is an obvious evidential piece of info but where is the evidence for who is pulling the strings from Jerusalem today.

I haven't left the Game Doc. just lining up my ducks!

Jerusalem represents the talmudic pharisees. They are the ones who run the world for satan through:

- FREEMASONRY
- GLOBAL FINANCE
- GLOBAL MEDIA (HOLLYWOOD/PRESS)
- COMMUNISM/BOLSHEVISM/SOCIALISM
- POLITICS OF RELIGION (NOAHIDE LAWS)

They run their game out of many prominant cities. London, New York, Rome, Paris etc....but its the people and the DOCTRINES we should be looking at not the location.

Same enemy in Jesus day, same today. Nothing new under the sun. Oral traditions nullifying Gods perfect law.

Grandpa wrote:Jerusalem is the whore but she does not run the world. There is a god of this world and that system is what runs this world. It permeates everything. News, Politics, Television (hellevision), governments, people.

A whore doesn't run the world. A whore causes destruction. A whore makes her husband sad.

Well, the whore uses her Golems to run the world in a beast system. She uses her lovers. Just like the pharisees used the Roman garrison to execute Jesus.

So in essence, yes she does rule the world and these apostate hebrews who claim the title 'jews' (but who are actually TALMUDISTS) are the Synagogue of Satan. They do his work for him.

One day the lovers will rise up and destroy the whore.

Who are the two witnesses spoken of in Revelation clothed in sackcloth?

MUSKOKAMAN wrote:Who are the two witnesses spoken of in Revelation clothed in sackcloth?

I think its just an allegory for the remnant.

Two witnesses have always been the the minimum number to establish a fact legally...so I'd say this is talking about the small amount of saints that would preach the truth in the endtimes.

I dont think its talking about literally two individuals.

No I don't think so Doc. The scripture is too explicit for it to be just an allegory.

They both are clothed in sackcloth for 1

They are both killed and their bodies left in the street for 3 1/2 days.

Then both rise in Jerusalem (this is where it will take place) to be brought up before God in full view of all around!

Then an earthquake killing 7000 in the selfsame hour.

This most definitely a sign to be looked for not an allegory!

MUSKOKAMAN wrote:No I don't think so Doc. The scripture is too explicit for it to be just an allegory.

They both are clothed in sackcloth for 1

They are both killed and their bodies left in the street for 3 1/2 days.

Then both rise in Jerusalem (this is where it will take place) to be brought up before God in full view of all around!

Then an earthquake killing 7000 in the selfsame hour.

This most definitely a sign to be looked for not an allegory!

So your going with the Hollywood movie script rather than the 'Revelations as a metaphorical book' angle?

Hmmmkay Musky.

Try not to get caught out with the hoax when the bad guys fake the eschaton ya?

dunno why its hard to see that the harlot ruling the world in the open is yet future.

the mystery of inquity is going on the whole time: not til satan's little season is it full throttle....soon.

its currently restrained.

we'll know its here when the Vatican throws the fight.

Strangelove wrote:

So your going with the Hollywood movie script rather than the 'Revelations as a metaphorical book' angle?



Hmmmkay Musky.

Try not to get caught out with the hoax when the bad guys fake the eschaton ya?

How do you fake 3 1/2 days dead to be resurrected and taken up to heaven in full view of everyone?

We're not talking about bluebeam fixing a hologram for us to see!

Or the haarp project creating earthquakes in Japan and Chile (though maybe they will in Jerusalem as a diversion after the 2 witnesses are risen?)